Former National Intelligence Director: ‘I’m Concerned’ About Biden’s China Policies, Not Backed By Intel

BILL HEMMER, FOX NEWS HOST: I’m Bill Hemmer, this is Hemmer Time. My guest today former Director of National Intelligence, John Ratcliffe. And, sir, thank you for your time.

JOHN RATCLIFFE, FORMER DNI Director: You bet, Bill always good to be with you.

HEMMER: You have a wealth of knowledge about threats around the world and here at home.  I think in a general sense, where do you direct your attention? Where do you watch?

RATCLIFFE:  Yeah, so Bill, what I would say is, you know, having the unique opportunity to really see more intelligence than anyone in the country for the past year, you know, I’ve thought about it each day for the past year. And and even as I left the position in January, you know, sort of thought, where do we need to be focused now and in the future, and, and there’s really three areas, and that’s sort of a, you know, now, and then short, the intermediate term, and then longer term. And, as you know, I’ve talked a lot about China and China is the greatest national security threat as a nation that we need to deal with right now. Cybersecurity is the greatest national security risk or threat that we face, you know, as a nation right now. And then longer term space, space is the next frontier that we need to make sure that we dominate and it controls so much about our lives that down the road, whoever controls space, and the rules in space, you know, our national security is just is very much tied to that when you look at how dependent we are on satellite technology, and, and those kinds of things. So, you know, there’s always concerns, you know, on a day to day basis about certain terrorist threats in certain places as it comes up around the world, but, but really, from sort of the 10,000 foot view, the things that sort of keep you awake and know that are going to be long-term, persistent problems that our country is going to face that we need to face as a nation to remain the world’s dominant superpower, that’s where my mind goes down.

HEMMER: Interesting. Let me come back to space in a moment, I always thought the nation that can defend its satellites, wins. And that might be 20 or 30 years down the road, but I’ll circle back to that. How’s Joe Biden doing?

RATCLIFFE: Yeah, too early to tell. Um, you know, I liked some of the rhetoric that came out early on from some of the folks as they were going through the confirmation process and sort of tough talk on China. And you know, and I’ll say this, you know, we need Joe Biden and his administration to be successful in the realm of intelligence and national security or we all suffer. It’s easy to get caught up in partisan politics and having said that, you know, I’m concerned. Because the president himself, President Biden, has taken some positions early on, with respect to, particularly with respect to both China and Iran, that, frankly, Bill, setting all politics aside are not supported by by our current intelligence and the threat landscape. And things can’t have changed that much for some of the policy decisions that he’s advocating for, they just don’t line up with, with some of the positions that he’s taking. So, I’m concerned about that, you know and, but, you know, like I said, I think it’s just it’s too early to tell.

HEMMER: Let’s go a little deeper on China, you wrote a piece back on the third of December 2020, which seems so long ago, you wrote China is national security threat number one. You conclude the following way, ‘this generation will be judged by its response to China’s effort to reshape the world in its own image, and replace America as the dominant superpower. The intelligence is clear, our response must be as well.’ Explain.

RATCLIFFE: Yeah. So, you know, the title of this was China’s national security threat. Number one, what I really wanted the title to be was, look, the elections over can we all now be honest about China? Because, you know, for the past year, and I don’t mean to minimize the threat of Russia events, like the recent Solar Winds cyber hack really underscores that, you know, Russia is a dangerous adversary. But as again, to my point about seeing more intelligence than anyone, it became increasingly clear that, as dangerous as Russia can be, they have a very limited toolkit. And the best way to demonstrate that Bill is to is to point out the fact that the United States has the largest economy in the world. China has the second largest economy in the world, and Russia is not in the top 10. In fact, if Texas were a country, and some of us here in Texas think that we should be, the economy of Texas is larger than the economy of Russia, so Russia can only afford to be dangerous in certain places. China is competing with us everywhere. And we just see that and as I looked at different threat streams of intelligence, whether it were related to, you know, economic espionage, whether it related to military power, whether related to emerging technologies and the things that they were doing with companies like Huawei, China’s competing with us everywhere, and are becoming near peer competitors with us in places where there used to be big gaps, and now there’s a question whether we’re even leading on some technology issues, China’s frankly, you know, shoulder to shoulder with us right now and it’s very clear what the national strategy is the China is taking. And, you know, if we don’t recognize and rise to that it really is the challenge of this generation, and we won’t be the world’s greatest superpower, if we don’t take that seriously. … I just want the Biden administration to be honest about it and, you know, and so one of the things, you know, without, you know, getting into, you know, obviously, a lot of the folks that what we’re finding out that are in the administration, you know, have worked with China, and frankly, you know, have gotten rich doing work with China. And so, will they hold China accountable? And and that’s a question when I say it’s too soon to tell, what I really mean is, you know, will people do what they’re supposed to do, which is put our national security interests first? And if we do that, we all need to recognize the threat that China is and there seems to be a bipartisan consensus in terms of, you know, things now on Capitol Hill, the way people talk about China. But you know, actions are different than words. And you know, and we need the actions to reflect the problem, the threat that China faces, or presents to us

HEMMER: About 18 months ago, I think Joe Biden as a candidate was in Iowa, and he said that the possibility of China eating our lunch is not going to happen. It was a common man kind of response. Well, earlier in the week, he changed. And in the Oval Office, he’s on camera saying, China’s going to eat our lunch. Well, why would he makes such a pivot? After talking with President Xi on the phone?

RATCLIFFE: Well, what I like to say is that when he made the comment in Iowa, he wasn’t getting the benefit of, you know, the intelligence briefings that he started to receive when he became president-elect. And like I said, that, you know, you pointed out the, you know, the Wall Street Journal op-ed, and, you know, the, you know, as I said, in the conclusion, the intelligence is clear, and our response has to be as well. And, you know, I have to think that, that he and his advisors were, you know, I don’t know if surprised is the right word, but when you look at it, and you look at how quickly, China has closed the gap, and the things that they are doing, where they’re spending money, and you can’t help but be concerned, you know, about China’s ability to challenge us, as I said, you know, in certain places without, you know, I don’t want to talk about those in detail, because it, it poses a national security threat to acknowledge that, but there are places where China’s frankly, doing a better job, and it’s further down the curve on some technology issues than we are and that that’s never been the case before.

HEMMER: I know what the readout was from the White House after that two hour phone call with the Chinese president. I don’t know what the readout was in China, or within the Communist Party. But some insiders are whispering and reporting that President Xi was aggressive. Does that make sense to you?

RATCLIFFE: Absolutely. I think China and and, frankly, to a lesser extent, Iran, what I can tell you is this Bill is that the intelligence was also clear that, you know, countries have to have preferences in terms of who they would hope would win the election and, and China and Iran, both, you know, we’re hopeful that that President Biden would be elected because the policies of the Trump administration were, frankly, somewhat a confrontational to China and to Iran both. And I think what you’re seeing in both cases, to some extent, they’re now testing this administration. And they’re looking to see weaknesses. I mean, look, what we saw, you know, China immediately in this administration, you know, bombers flew over Taiwan. The threats in the South China Sea became more expansive. They talked, you know, they immediately issued sanctions against certain US officials from the Trump administration, took actions against people like, you know, Jack Ma, and and, you know, and Jimmy Lai, and in Hong Kong, and, you know, so all of those things are places to see, wait a minute, when, you know, the Trump administration and the President Trump would push back or hold to account on on actions that take China has taken, will the Biden administration push back? And I think that’s what you’re seeing with President Xi is, he wants to see what he can get away with with President Biden, and will there be pushed back like there was in our administration?